[ADVERTISEMENT] open positions in Apple's Swift compiler team

classic Classic list List threaded Threaded
18 messages Options
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

[ADVERTISEMENT] open positions in Apple's Swift compiler team

Ted Kremenek
** NOTE: This is a compiler job announcement. **

The Apple Source Languages team is looking for exceptional engineers to work on the Swift programming language:


These open positions are for engineers who want to work as an integral part of the core Swift language team to help shape the future of the language.

All positions are based onsite at Apple's main campus in Cupertino, California.  To apply, please send applications to:

  swift-team-apply at group dot apple dot com

When applying, please include:

- Brief statement about yourself and how you see a potential mutual fit with the team (e.g., interests, background, etc.).
- Resume in Text or PDF form.

We are looking to fill the following positions:

* Compiler frontend/language engineers to work on the Swift language.

This position is for an engineer to work on evolving and implementing the core Swift language.

Ideal candidates will have skills in the following areas:

- A passion for bringing great language design and implementation to a mainstream audience.
- Strong C++ coding skills.
- Familiarity with LLVM or Clang a plus, but not required.
- Diverse exposure to different programming languages.
- Familiarity with Cocoa and Objective-C (although not required).

* Source tool engineers to work on next generation "source tools" (code completion, refactoring):

This position is for an engineer to work on source-level tools such as code completion, refactoring, and source code indexing that will be utilized in development environments such as Xcode.

Ideal candidates will have skills in the following areas:

- A passion for building innovative and intuitive source tools that enhance programmer productivity.
- Strong C++ coding skills.
- Familiarity with LLVM or Clang a plus, but not required.
- Expertise in indexing, refactoring and similar tools a big plus.

* Runtime engineers to work on the Swift language runtime.

This position for an engineer to work on the core language runtime, which is an essential part of the language implementation.  This includes interfacing with Objective-C, but also providing a high performing runtime implementation of the Swift language on various architectures.

Ideal candidates will have skills in the following areas:

- Experience with low-level concurrency primitives and algorithms (atomics, lock-free algorithms, etc.)
- Strong knowledge low-level hardware details (x86, ARM)
- Strong skills in low-level performance optimization.
- Knowledge of programming languages and their runtime implementations.

* Engineers to work on the Swift core standard library.

Swift's core standard library provides much of the user-facing experience of Swift, from basic types like Int to Unicode processing to lazy generic sequence adapters.  These engineers would join a team whose mission is to help programmers use the full power of the Swift core language while maintaining fundamental coherence and simplicity of programming model.

Ideal candidates will have skills in the following areas:

- A passion for making a difference in the lives of other programmers
- A deep understanding of generic programming principles
- Experience with functional programming languages and/or idioms
- Experience bridging languages, especially bridging dynamic languages with static ones 
- Exposure to innovative and/or comprehensive library designs


Please forward to anyone who may be interested.

Thanks!
Ted

_______________________________________________
cfe-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [LLVMdev] [ADVERTISEMENT] open positions in Apple's Swift compiler team

C Bergström
On 06/11/14 06:58 AM, Ted Kremenek wrote:
> ** NOTE: This is a compiler job announcement. **
>
> The Apple Source Languages team is looking for exceptional engineers
> to work on the Swift programming language:
Maybe this has been asked already and I missed it - Will Swift be open
source?
_______________________________________________
cfe-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [LLVMdev] [ADVERTISEMENT] open positions in Apple's Swift compiler team

Ted Kremenek
On Jun 10, 2014, at 5:36 PM, C. Bergström <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 06/11/14 06:58 AM, Ted Kremenek wrote:
>> ** NOTE: This is a compiler job announcement. **
>>
>> The Apple Source Languages team is looking for exceptional engineers to work on the Swift programming language:
> Maybe this has been asked already and I missed it - Will Swift be open source?

At this time, we honestly don't know the answer yet to that question.
_______________________________________________
cfe-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [LLVMdev] [ADVERTISEMENT] open positions in Apple's Swift compiler team

Jorgen Tjerno
In reply to this post by C Bergström
So far the answer is "no comment":
http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/pipermail/cfe-users/2014-June/000492.html

- Jørgen.


On Tue, Jun 10, 2014 at 5:36 PM, "C. Bergström"
<[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 06/11/14 06:58 AM, Ted Kremenek wrote:
>>
>> ** NOTE: This is a compiler job announcement. **
>>
>> The Apple Source Languages team is looking for exceptional engineers to
>> work on the Swift programming language:
>
> Maybe this has been asked already and I missed it - Will Swift be open
> source?
> _______________________________________________
> cfe-dev mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev

_______________________________________________
cfe-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [LLVMdev] [ADVERTISEMENT] open positions in Apple's Swift compiler team

Chandler Carruth
In reply to this post by Ted Kremenek

On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 1:44 AM, Ted Kremenek <[hidden email]> wrote:
On Jun 10, 2014, at 5:36 PM, C. Bergström <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 06/11/14 06:58 AM, Ted Kremenek wrote:
>> ** NOTE: This is a compiler job announcement. **
>>
>> The Apple Source Languages team is looking for exceptional engineers to work on the Swift programming language:
> Maybe this has been asked already and I missed it - Will Swift be open source?

At this time, we honestly don't know the answer yet to that question.

Ted, we've routinely pushed back strongly against job postings for compiler jobs that aren't specifically working on LLVM, Clang, or some other part of the LLVM project.

If Swift ends up open source, and if it ends up as part of the LLVM project (neither of which seem clear as you say), only then would it seem appropriate to send this kind of job ad email to these lists.

This is the second off-topic job posting in the last few weeks, so I'm particularly sensitive. I really don't want the lists to become cluttered here.

Thanks,
-Chandler

_______________________________________________
cfe-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [LLVMdev] [ADVERTISEMENT] open positions in Apple's Swift compiler team

Joerg Sonnenberger
On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 02:39:08PM +0100, Chandler Carruth wrote:
> Ted, we've routinely pushed back strongly against job postings for compiler
> jobs that aren't specifically working on LLVM, Clang, or some other part of
> the LLVM project.

At the very least, the mail didn't make it clear that Swift is a project
on top of LLVM. Not everyone went to the Apple house conference and
knows it.

Joerg
_______________________________________________
cfe-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [LLVMdev] [ADVERTISEMENT] open positions in Apple's Swift compiler team

John Criswell-2
In reply to this post by Chandler Carruth
Dear All,

Historically, we *have* permitted job announcements for jobs that require or desire expertise with LLVM or one of it's sub-projects.  To the best of my knowledge, we've never required that the position announcement state that the job will contribute directly to the LLVM project (or its sub-projects) or that the code created by the position be open source.

As an example, please see http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/pipermail/llvmdev/2014-May/072938.html and http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/pipermail/llvmdev/2010-August/033695.html.

Using this criteria, I believe that Ted's post is on-topic (although I agree that it should have stated the connection with LLVM more prominently).

If there is now an official policy that I've overlooked stating otherwise, please let me know.

Regards,

John Criswell


On 6/11/14, 8:39 AM, Chandler Carruth wrote:

On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 1:44 AM, Ted Kremenek <[hidden email]> wrote:
On Jun 10, 2014, at 5:36 PM, C. Bergström <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 06/11/14 06:58 AM, Ted Kremenek wrote:
>> ** NOTE: This is a compiler job announcement. **
>>
>> The Apple Source Languages team is looking for exceptional engineers to work on the Swift programming language:
> Maybe this has been asked already and I missed it - Will Swift be open source?

At this time, we honestly don't know the answer yet to that question.

Ted, we've routinely pushed back strongly against job postings for compiler jobs that aren't specifically working on LLVM, Clang, or some other part of the LLVM project.

If Swift ends up open source, and if it ends up as part of the LLVM project (neither of which seem clear as you say), only then would it seem appropriate to send this kind of job ad email to these lists.

This is the second off-topic job posting in the last few weeks, so I'm particularly sensitive. I really don't want the lists to become cluttered here.

Thanks,
-Chandler


_______________________________________________
LLVM Developers mailing list
[hidden email]         http://llvm.cs.uiuc.edu
http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/llvmdev


_______________________________________________
cfe-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [LLVMdev] [ADVERTISEMENT] open positions in Apple's Swift compiler team

Chandler Carruth

On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 3:59 PM, John Criswell <[hidden email]> wrote:
Dear All,

Historically, we *have* permitted job announcements for jobs that require or desire expertise with LLVM or one of it's sub-projects.  To the best of my knowledge, we've never required that the position announcement state that the job will contribute directly to the LLVM project (or its sub-projects) or that the code created by the position be open source.

As an example, please see http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/pipermail/llvmdev/2014-May/072938.html and http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/pipermail/llvmdev/2010-August/033695.html.

Using this criteria, I believe that Ted's post is on-topic (although I agree that it should have stated the connection with LLVM more prominently).

The connection or relevance of LLVM experience really isn't clear... "Familiarity with LLVM or Clang a plus, but not required." makes it seem like it is not terribly relevant, which was the source of my concern.

_______________________________________________
cfe-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [LLVMdev] [ADVERTISEMENT] open positions in Apple's Swift compiler team

C Bergström
In reply to this post by Chandler Carruth
On 06/11/14 08:39 PM, Chandler Carruth wrote:

>
> On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 1:44 AM, Ted Kremenek <[hidden email]
> <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
>
>     On Jun 10, 2014, at 5:36 PM, C. Bergström
>     <[hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
>
>     > On 06/11/14 06:58 AM, Ted Kremenek wrote:
>     >> ** NOTE: This is a compiler job announcement. **
>     >>
>     >> The Apple Source Languages team is looking for exceptional
>     engineers to work on the Swift programming language:
>     > Maybe this has been asked already and I missed it - Will Swift
>     be open source?
>
>     At this time, we honestly don't know the answer yet to that question.
>
>
> Ted, we've routinely pushed back strongly against job postings for
> compiler jobs that aren't specifically working on LLVM, Clang, or some
> other part of the LLVM project.
>
> If Swift ends up open source, and if it ends up as part of the LLVM
> project (neither of which seem clear as you say), only then would it
> seem appropriate to send this kind of job ad email to these lists.
>
> This is the second off-topic job posting in the last few weeks, so I'm
> particularly sensitive. I really don't want the lists to become
> cluttered here.
In the past myself and others have posted clang related jobs which
aren't open source. I don't think that should be a strict requirement
and sorry for the noise my question brought up.

_______________________________________________
cfe-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [LLVMdev] [ADVERTISEMENT] open positions in Apple's Swift compiler team

Chandler Carruth

On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 4:07 PM, "C. Bergström" <[hidden email]> wrote:
In the past myself and others have posted clang related jobs which aren't open source. I don't think that should be a strict requirement and sorry for the noise my question brought up.

Again, a Clang related job would be fine. This is a Swift related job, and Swift isn't yet part of LLVM (and it isn't even clear whether it will be).

_______________________________________________
cfe-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [LLVMdev] [ADVERTISEMENT] open positions in Apple's Swift compiler team

C Bergström
On 06/11/14 10:11 PM, Chandler Carruth wrote:

>
> On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 4:07 PM, "C. Bergström"
> <[hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
>
>     In the past myself and others have posted clang related jobs which
>     aren't open source. I don't think that should be a strict
>     requirement and sorry for the noise my question brought up.
>
>
> Again, a Clang related job would be fine. This is a Swift related job,
> and Swift isn't yet part of LLVM (and it isn't even clear whether it
> will be).
You're splitting hairs - It's clear to me in reading what has been
posting publicly that Swift is using the LLVM/Clang infrastructure. I
can find a link if it really makes a difference.
_______________________________________________
cfe-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [LLVMdev] [ADVERTISEMENT] open positions in Apple's Swift compiler team

Joerg Sonnenberger
In reply to this post by John Criswell-2
On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 09:59:19AM -0500, John Criswell wrote:

> Historically, we *have* permitted job announcements for jobs that
> require or desire expertise with LLVM or one of it's sub-projects.
> To the best of my knowledge, we've never required that the position
> announcement state that the job will contribute directly to the LLVM
> project (or its sub-projects) or that the code created by the
> position be open source.
>
> As an example, please see
> http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/pipermail/llvmdev/2014-May/072938.html and
> http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/pipermail/llvmdev/2010-August/033695.html.
>
> Using this criteria, I believe that Ted's post is on-topic (although
> I agree that it should have stated the connection with LLVM more
> prominently).
>
> If there is now an official policy that I've overlooked stating
> otherwise, please let me know.

I'm not sure we have one, so it might be a good idea to sit down and
really finalize it. I have tried to write down the criteria *I* consider
acceptable in

http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/pipermail/llvmdev/2014-June/073497.html

Joerg
_______________________________________________
cfe-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [LLVMdev] [ADVERTISEMENT] open positions in Apple's Swift compiler team

Philip Reames
In reply to this post by C Bergström
On 06/11/2014 08:20 AM, "C. Bergström" wrote:

> On 06/11/14 10:11 PM, Chandler Carruth wrote:
>>
>> On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 4:07 PM, "C. Bergström"
>> <[hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
>>
>>     In the past myself and others have posted clang related jobs which
>>     aren't open source. I don't think that should be a strict
>>     requirement and sorry for the noise my question brought up.
>>
>>
>> Again, a Clang related job would be fine. This is a Swift related
>> job, and Swift isn't yet part of LLVM (and it isn't even clear
>> whether it will be).
> You're splitting hairs - It's clear to me in reading what has been
> posting publicly that Swift is using the LLVM/Clang infrastructure. I
> can find a link if it really makes a difference.
To be fair, it's an important hair to split.  :)

Personally I find the job postings relevant and useful, but I would
second Chandler's point that they need to be clearly related to jobs
using LLVM technologies.  Closed source positions are fine.  Closed
source positions that don't want to acknowledge LLVM usage are not.
General compiler/runtime jobs should not be posted here.  The burden of
showing a posting is related lies on the author, not on every member of
the list to be aware of related content.

Having said all that, I had no concerns about the original posting.

Philip

_______________________________________________
cfe-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [LLVMdev] [ADVERTISEMENT] open positions in Apple's Swift compiler team

Adam Treat
In reply to this post by Ted Kremenek
That is surprising since Swift has reportedly been in development for a
number of years internally. Apple has a long history with Open Source
including this very project.  You had to know that this question was
going to be asked very quickly after the announcement.  Given that you
don't have an answer even now I would tend to be pessimistic...

On 06/10/2014 08:44 PM, Ted Kremenek wrote:

> On Jun 10, 2014, at 5:36 PM, C. Bergström <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> On 06/11/14 06:58 AM, Ted Kremenek wrote:
>>> ** NOTE: This is a compiler job announcement. **
>>>
>>> The Apple Source Languages team is looking for exceptional engineers to work on the Swift programming language:
>> Maybe this has been asked already and I missed it - Will Swift be open source?
> At this time, we honestly don't know the answer yet to that question.
> _______________________________________________
> LLVM Developers mailing list
> [hidden email]         http://llvm.cs.uiuc.edu
> http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/llvmdev

_______________________________________________
cfe-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [LLVMdev] [ADVERTISEMENT] open positions in Apple's Swift compiler team

C Bergström
On 06/11/14 10:56 PM, Adam Treat wrote:
> That is surprising since Swift has reportedly been in development for
> a number of years internally. Apple has a long history with Open
> Source including this very project.  You had to know that this
> question was going to be asked very quickly after the announcement.  
> Given that you don't have an answer even now I would tend to be
> pessimistic...
I wouldn't be pessimistic so quickly - Remember that most likely the
engineers were just focused on the technical side and maybe didn't even
have a chance to look about getting it pushed publicly. Even though
Lattner has a lot of influence at Apple - there are tall legal hurdles
for large public companies.

If it gets enough developer adoption - I'm sure someone (from Apple or
community) will eventually start to contribute patches upstream to clang.
_______________________________________________
cfe-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [LLVMdev] [ADVERTISEMENT] open positions in Apple's Swift compiler team

Adam Treat
On 06/11/2014 01:17 PM, "C. Bergström" wrote:

> On 06/11/14 10:56 PM, Adam Treat wrote:
>> That is surprising since Swift has reportedly been in development for
>> a number of years internally. Apple has a long history with Open
>> Source including this very project.  You had to know that this
>> question was going to be asked very quickly after the announcement.  
>> Given that you don't have an answer even now I would tend to be
>> pessimistic...
> I wouldn't be pessimistic so quickly - Remember that most likely the
> engineers were just focused on the technical side and maybe didn't
> even have a chance to look about getting it pushed publicly. Even
> though Lattner has a lot of influence at Apple - there are tall legal
> hurdles for large public companies.
>
> If it gets enough developer adoption - I'm sure someone (from Apple or
> community) will eventually start to contribute patches upstream to clang.
Sure.  To be clear I am not complaining, just observing.  I have no
problem if they choose not to open source it.  That is totally within
their rights of course :)
_______________________________________________
cfe-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [LLVMdev] [ADVERTISEMENT] open positions in Apple's Swift compiler team

Chris Lattner
In reply to this post by Adam Treat
Guys, feel free to make up your own dragons if you want, but your speculation is just that: speculation.  We literally have not even discussed this yet, because we have a ton of work to do to respond to the huge volume of feedback we're getting, and have to get a huge number of things (e.g. access control!) done before the 1.0 release this fall.  You can imagine that many of us want it to be open source and part of llvm, but the discussion hasn't happened yet, and won't for some time.

Sorry to leave you all hanging, but there is just far too much to deal with right now.

-Chris


> On Jun 11, 2014, at 8:56 AM, Adam Treat <[hidden email]> wrote:
> That is surprising since Swift has reportedly been in development for a number of years internally. Apple has a long history with Open Source including this very project.  You had to know that this question was going to be asked very quickly after the announcement.  Given that you don't have an answer even now I would tend to be pessimistic...
>
> On 06/10/2014 08:44 PM, Ted Kremenek wrote:
>> On Jun 10, 2014, at 5:36 PM, C. Bergström <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>>> On 06/11/14 06:58 AM, Ted Kremenek wrote:
>>>> ** NOTE: This is a compiler job announcement. **
>>>>
>>>> The Apple Source Languages team is looking for exceptional engineers to work on the Swift programming language:
>>> Maybe this has been asked already and I missed it - Will Swift be open source?
>> At this time, we honestly don't know the answer yet to that question.
>> _______________________________________________
>> LLVM Developers mailing list
>> [hidden email]         http://llvm.cs.uiuc.edu
>> http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/llvmdev
>
> _______________________________________________
> cfe-dev mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev


_______________________________________________
cfe-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [LLVMdev] [ADVERTISEMENT] open positions in Apple's Swift compiler team

Ted Kremenek
In reply to this post by Joerg Sonnenberger
On Jun 11, 2014, at 7:03 AM, Joerg Sonnenberger <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 02:39:08PM +0100, Chandler Carruth wrote:
Ted, we've routinely pushed back strongly against job postings for compiler
jobs that aren't specifically working on LLVM, Clang, or some other part of
the LLVM project.

At the very least, the mail didn't make it clear that Swift is a project
on top of LLVM. Not everyone went to the Apple house conference and
knows it.

My apologies, I should have made it more clear.

That said, I didn't think to underscore it since it's been widely known in the LLVM community how active Apple's compiler team has been (and continues to be) involved in LLVM and Clang.  I find it difficult to believe that anyone on this list was actually confused about that point, but in future posts I will try to make that point more clear.

_______________________________________________
cfe-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev